"Today's Christian often longs for true communion with God as was seen in Bible times. People often lament, 'Things were easier back then when God spoke to people and told them what to do.' Well, friend, that type of intimate involvement with God is available to all. He is just as willing to talk to you and to me as He was to David or Paul. The continuous interchange between God and man is the heart of saving grace and living faith. This is the gospel experience that saves us. It's not our doctrine or our beliefs but a continual communion between the soul and God. It is reaching out over the gulf that separates us and crossing over from a self-directed life to a new and better, Spirit-directed way of living. It is only in realizing our powerlessness and in stepping out in faith to cooperate in the strength of heaven that we wrest ourselves from the bonds of sin and selfishness that have so long held us captive." - p.56
"Every morning as I rise, the first and foremost piece of business I must attend to is the surrendering of myself to the present will of God for my life. This means that I must choose of my own volition to give to another - that is God - control of every aspect of my life. What do I mean by that? I mean surrender of every choice, every thought, and every emotion to the control of God. Then this surrender must be maintained through the influence of God's Spirit upon my mind throughout the day." - p.31
Saturday, March 7, 2009
Tuesday, March 3, 2009
Ellen White to Adventists
In a statement that should surely be a reproof to those Adventists out there who can quote Ellen White statements as a reason for their various beliefs, but have a difficult time recalling the Bible texts which prove their doctrine, she spoke these wonderful words:
"Lay Sister White right to one side: lay her to one side. Don't you ever quote my words again as long as you live, until you can obey the Bible. When you take the Bible and make that your food, and your meat, and your drink, and you make that the elements of your character, when you can do that you will know better how to receive some counsel from God. But here is the Word, the precious Word, exalted before you today. And don't you give a rap any more what 'Sister White Said' —'Sister White said this,' and 'Sister White said that,' and 'Sister White said the other thing'. But say, 'Thus saith the Lord God of Israel.' " - EGW
"Lay Sister White right to one side: lay her to one side. Don't you ever quote my words again as long as you live, until you can obey the Bible. When you take the Bible and make that your food, and your meat, and your drink, and you make that the elements of your character, when you can do that you will know better how to receive some counsel from God. But here is the Word, the precious Word, exalted before you today. And don't you give a rap any more what 'Sister White Said' —'Sister White said this,' and 'Sister White said that,' and 'Sister White said the other thing'. But say, 'Thus saith the Lord God of Israel.' " - EGW
Sunday, March 1, 2009
Paul Harvey, Asleep in Christ
On Saturday, February 28, 2009, Paul Harvey died at age 90 in Phoenix, Arizona. A spokesman for ABC Radio Network said he died in his winter home surrounded by family. I've heard it said by some that he was the "most trusted person in America."
According to www.adherents.com, Paul Harvey was baptized into the Seventh-day Adventist church around the year 2000 and regularly attended the Camelback Seventh-day Adventist church in Arizona.
It's been said that he oftentimes quoted from Ellen White on his radio broadcast even before he became an Adventist. Harvey stated: "Ellen White: You don’t know her? Get to know her!”
He will be missed.
According to www.adherents.com, Paul Harvey was baptized into the Seventh-day Adventist church around the year 2000 and regularly attended the Camelback Seventh-day Adventist church in Arizona.
It's been said that he oftentimes quoted from Ellen White on his radio broadcast even before he became an Adventist. Harvey stated: "Ellen White: You don’t know her? Get to know her!”
He will be missed.
Regarding Death: An Adventist Response to Critics
I have heard many Christians profess that the Adventist teaching on the state of the dead is a new doctrine. This post is to clear up that misconception.
Below is an exchange between myself and a visitor to Our Sword named Dennis Fischer, a former Adventist, who responded to an Adventist Review article I posted by Clifford Goldstein entitled "Seventh-day Darwinians."
Dennis Fischer's Original Comment-
"Seventh-day Adventist biologists (primarily science teachers in their school system) have for a long time already ignored Ellen White's mandated six-thousand-year view of the age of the earth. With their amazing cognitive dissonance (believing in two opposing views simultaneously), Seventh-day Adventists have learned to pick-and-choose their favorite doctrines while still warming the pews on a regular basis.
Interestingly, SDA dogma about the state of the dead reinforces the notion that man is basically an animal--they even die just like animals they insist. The only difference being that they are in the remembrance of God like a fallen sparrow. Moreover, one cannot await anything when nonexistent--much less a resurrection. Official Adventism needs to become consistent in its teachings."
My Response-
"My point is not that we need to be able to make sense of our own beliefs, or even to reconcile them, for I could clarify your statements about dying like animals and awaiting the resurrection. My problem is when Christians try to intertwine the plain meaning of Scripture with ideas that contradict those Scriptures.
I don't care if one tries and succeeds at believing both creation and evolution, or that we go straight to heaven or hell when we die yet there's still a future resurrection and judgement. As stand-alone philosophies, it doesn't matter what we conclude, because they are our own human ideas. What bothers me is when people in the church try to force their own human philosophies onto Scriptures so plain even a little child could understand them.
Check out my post "are the dead really dead" for a lot of Bible verses about the subject, clearly indicating that the dead are not in heaven or hell, but in the grave. I'd be honestly interested to hear how you explain these verses. I will listen with an open mind."
Dennis Fischer's Counter-Response-
"Todd,
For believers death means being "away from the body and at home with the Lord" (2 Cor. 5:8). That is why our Lord said at his death, "Father, into your hands I commit my spirit" (Lk. 23:46). That is why he promised the penitent dying thief, "Today you will be with me in paradise" (Lk. 23:43). That is why Paul described departing the body to be with Christ as "better by far" than remaining in the body (Phil. 1:23). And that is why Scripture speaks of deceased human beings as souls "under the altar" (Rev. 6:9) and as "the spirits of righteous men made perfect" (Heb. 12:23).
If Jesus the God-man ceased to exist between his death and resurrection, then the Trinity only consisted of two persons during that period of time. The Trinity would have been reduced to a Binity, or the resurrection of Jesus meant the re-creation of the second person of the Trinity. In that case, the second person of the Trinity would be a created being. Such conclusions are ruinous for the Christian faith because they compromise the doctrine of the Trinity. The SDA view of death is the heritage of their Arian founders. Moreover, the investigative judgment alibi cannot allow saints to be in heaven before its final verdict.
Adventist apologists also insist that Moses was resurrected from dead and taken to heaven without any biblical support for their claim. Obviously, their belief system cannot reconcile the fact that Moses and Elijah appeared together on the Mount of Transfiguration representing the law and the prophets. If Moses was resurrected from the dead, as Adventists claim, then it negates the NT teaching the Jesus is the "firstfruit from the dead." This is yet another instance where SDA theology diminishes the glory that belongs to Jesus. All in all, the traditional view of death coheres well with other biblical teachings in contrast to the extinction/re-creation view.
Both Christians and SDAs acknowledge that in the Scriptures the word "sleep" (as applied to death)is imagery, or figurative language. The division comes over what, exactly, is the REALITY of which sleep is apt imagery. In real sleep, there is a real, living person present; one's existence, thoughts, and emotions continue from the waking state, through the sleep state, and back again into the waking state. One's mind is not totally inactive during sleep. Even more important, one's actual existence is not interrupted."
My Final Response-
"So there are 6 Scriptures you've mentioned as proof of your view regarding the state of the dead.
I have heard many preachers, and I have myself, explained these texts in their context to show they do not, in fact, teach that the dead go straight to heaven or hell when they die.
More importantly, those who believe that the dead rest in their graves until the resurrection have easily 10 times that number of Scriptures to back up their view, to which I have never heard a proper response and explanation.
Please don't believe everything you read or hear, I'm not too familiar with these arians you talked about, but I can tell you that even the reformers believed, or at least allowed the possibility, that the dead remain in the grave until resurrection.
Martin Luther: "We shall sleep, until He comes and knocks on the little grave and says, "Doctor Martin, get up! Then I shall rise in a moment, and be with him forever."
Martin Luther: "But we Christians, who have been redeemed from all this through the precious blood of God's Son, should train and accustom ourselves in faith to despise death and regard it as a deep, strong, sweet sleep."
Martin Luther: "We should learn to view our death in the right light, so that we need not become alarmed on account of it, as unbelief does; because in Christ it is indeed not death, but a fine, sweet and brief sleep, which brings us release from this vale of tears, from sin and from the fear and extremity of real death and from all the misfortunes of this life, and we shall be secure and without care, rest sweetly and gently for a brief moment, as on a sofa, until the time when he shall call and awaken us together with all his dear children to his eternal glory and joy. For since we call it a sleep, we know that we shall not remain in it, but be again awakened and live, and that the time during which we sleep, shall seem no longer than if we had just fallen asleep. Hence, we shall censure ourselves that we were surprised or alarmed at such a sleep in the hour of death, and suddenly come alive out of the grave and from decomposition, and entirely well, fresh, with a pure, clear, glorified life, meet our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ in the clouds."
William Tyndale: "And ye, in putting them [the departed souls] in heaven, hell, and purgatory, destroy the arguments wherewith Christ and Paul prove the resurrection.... And again, if the souls be in heaven, tell me why they be not in as good case as the angels be? And then what cause is there of the resurrection?"
William Tyndale: "Nay, Paul, thou art unlearned; go to Master More, and learn a new way. We be not most miserable, though we rise not again; for our souls go to heaven as soon as we be dead, and are there in as great joy as Christ that is risen again." And I marvel that Paul had not comforted the Thessalonians with that doctrine, if he had wist [known] it, that the souls of their dead had been in joy; as he did with the resurrection, that their dead should rise again. If the souls be in heaven, in as great glory as the angels, after your doctrine, shew me what cause should be of the resurrection."
William Tyndale: "And when he [More] proveth that the saints be in heaven in glory with Christ already, saying, "If God be their God, they be in heaven, for he is not the God of the dead;" there he stealeth away Christ's argument, wherewith he proveth the resurrection: that Abraham and all saints should rise again, and not that their souls were in heaven; which doctrine was not yet in the world. And with that doctrine he taketh away the resurrection quite, and maketh Christ's argument of none effect"
The list goes on of others who chose to let go of the traditions of men handed down to them and take hold of the Scriptures as their sole source of truth.
I believe there is a root of pride in those who cling to a select few Scriptures to prove their belief instead of searching the Scriptures daily to see whether those things are so.
Also, it seems rather unChristian to slander a church and declare "you got that belief from this bunch," when in truth, we arrived at our beliefs from deep, earnest, unprideful study of the Holy Bible."
Below is an exchange between myself and a visitor to Our Sword named Dennis Fischer, a former Adventist, who responded to an Adventist Review article I posted by Clifford Goldstein entitled "Seventh-day Darwinians."
Dennis Fischer's Original Comment-
"Seventh-day Adventist biologists (primarily science teachers in their school system) have for a long time already ignored Ellen White's mandated six-thousand-year view of the age of the earth. With their amazing cognitive dissonance (believing in two opposing views simultaneously), Seventh-day Adventists have learned to pick-and-choose their favorite doctrines while still warming the pews on a regular basis.
Interestingly, SDA dogma about the state of the dead reinforces the notion that man is basically an animal--they even die just like animals they insist. The only difference being that they are in the remembrance of God like a fallen sparrow. Moreover, one cannot await anything when nonexistent--much less a resurrection. Official Adventism needs to become consistent in its teachings."
My Response-
"My point is not that we need to be able to make sense of our own beliefs, or even to reconcile them, for I could clarify your statements about dying like animals and awaiting the resurrection. My problem is when Christians try to intertwine the plain meaning of Scripture with ideas that contradict those Scriptures.
I don't care if one tries and succeeds at believing both creation and evolution, or that we go straight to heaven or hell when we die yet there's still a future resurrection and judgement. As stand-alone philosophies, it doesn't matter what we conclude, because they are our own human ideas. What bothers me is when people in the church try to force their own human philosophies onto Scriptures so plain even a little child could understand them.
Check out my post "are the dead really dead" for a lot of Bible verses about the subject, clearly indicating that the dead are not in heaven or hell, but in the grave. I'd be honestly interested to hear how you explain these verses. I will listen with an open mind."
Dennis Fischer's Counter-Response-
"Todd,
For believers death means being "away from the body and at home with the Lord" (2 Cor. 5:8). That is why our Lord said at his death, "Father, into your hands I commit my spirit" (Lk. 23:46). That is why he promised the penitent dying thief, "Today you will be with me in paradise" (Lk. 23:43). That is why Paul described departing the body to be with Christ as "better by far" than remaining in the body (Phil. 1:23). And that is why Scripture speaks of deceased human beings as souls "under the altar" (Rev. 6:9) and as "the spirits of righteous men made perfect" (Heb. 12:23).
If Jesus the God-man ceased to exist between his death and resurrection, then the Trinity only consisted of two persons during that period of time. The Trinity would have been reduced to a Binity, or the resurrection of Jesus meant the re-creation of the second person of the Trinity. In that case, the second person of the Trinity would be a created being. Such conclusions are ruinous for the Christian faith because they compromise the doctrine of the Trinity. The SDA view of death is the heritage of their Arian founders. Moreover, the investigative judgment alibi cannot allow saints to be in heaven before its final verdict.
Adventist apologists also insist that Moses was resurrected from dead and taken to heaven without any biblical support for their claim. Obviously, their belief system cannot reconcile the fact that Moses and Elijah appeared together on the Mount of Transfiguration representing the law and the prophets. If Moses was resurrected from the dead, as Adventists claim, then it negates the NT teaching the Jesus is the "firstfruit from the dead." This is yet another instance where SDA theology diminishes the glory that belongs to Jesus. All in all, the traditional view of death coheres well with other biblical teachings in contrast to the extinction/re-creation view.
Both Christians and SDAs acknowledge that in the Scriptures the word "sleep" (as applied to death)is imagery, or figurative language. The division comes over what, exactly, is the REALITY of which sleep is apt imagery. In real sleep, there is a real, living person present; one's existence, thoughts, and emotions continue from the waking state, through the sleep state, and back again into the waking state. One's mind is not totally inactive during sleep. Even more important, one's actual existence is not interrupted."
My Final Response-
"So there are 6 Scriptures you've mentioned as proof of your view regarding the state of the dead.
I have heard many preachers, and I have myself, explained these texts in their context to show they do not, in fact, teach that the dead go straight to heaven or hell when they die.
More importantly, those who believe that the dead rest in their graves until the resurrection have easily 10 times that number of Scriptures to back up their view, to which I have never heard a proper response and explanation.
Please don't believe everything you read or hear, I'm not too familiar with these arians you talked about, but I can tell you that even the reformers believed, or at least allowed the possibility, that the dead remain in the grave until resurrection.
Martin Luther: "We shall sleep, until He comes and knocks on the little grave and says, "Doctor Martin, get up! Then I shall rise in a moment, and be with him forever."
Martin Luther: "But we Christians, who have been redeemed from all this through the precious blood of God's Son, should train and accustom ourselves in faith to despise death and regard it as a deep, strong, sweet sleep."
Martin Luther: "We should learn to view our death in the right light, so that we need not become alarmed on account of it, as unbelief does; because in Christ it is indeed not death, but a fine, sweet and brief sleep, which brings us release from this vale of tears, from sin and from the fear and extremity of real death and from all the misfortunes of this life, and we shall be secure and without care, rest sweetly and gently for a brief moment, as on a sofa, until the time when he shall call and awaken us together with all his dear children to his eternal glory and joy. For since we call it a sleep, we know that we shall not remain in it, but be again awakened and live, and that the time during which we sleep, shall seem no longer than if we had just fallen asleep. Hence, we shall censure ourselves that we were surprised or alarmed at such a sleep in the hour of death, and suddenly come alive out of the grave and from decomposition, and entirely well, fresh, with a pure, clear, glorified life, meet our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ in the clouds."
William Tyndale: "And ye, in putting them [the departed souls] in heaven, hell, and purgatory, destroy the arguments wherewith Christ and Paul prove the resurrection.... And again, if the souls be in heaven, tell me why they be not in as good case as the angels be? And then what cause is there of the resurrection?"
William Tyndale: "Nay, Paul, thou art unlearned; go to Master More, and learn a new way. We be not most miserable, though we rise not again; for our souls go to heaven as soon as we be dead, and are there in as great joy as Christ that is risen again." And I marvel that Paul had not comforted the Thessalonians with that doctrine, if he had wist [known] it, that the souls of their dead had been in joy; as he did with the resurrection, that their dead should rise again. If the souls be in heaven, in as great glory as the angels, after your doctrine, shew me what cause should be of the resurrection."
William Tyndale: "And when he [More] proveth that the saints be in heaven in glory with Christ already, saying, "If God be their God, they be in heaven, for he is not the God of the dead;" there he stealeth away Christ's argument, wherewith he proveth the resurrection: that Abraham and all saints should rise again, and not that their souls were in heaven; which doctrine was not yet in the world. And with that doctrine he taketh away the resurrection quite, and maketh Christ's argument of none effect"
The list goes on of others who chose to let go of the traditions of men handed down to them and take hold of the Scriptures as their sole source of truth.
I believe there is a root of pride in those who cling to a select few Scriptures to prove their belief instead of searching the Scriptures daily to see whether those things are so.
Also, it seems rather unChristian to slander a church and declare "you got that belief from this bunch," when in truth, we arrived at our beliefs from deep, earnest, unprideful study of the Holy Bible."
Saturday, February 28, 2009
Adventists vs. Same-Sex Marriage
I assume, as with the creation/evolution debate, that the vast majority of Adventists stand firmly on the side of God's word when it comes to the same-sex marriage debate. Basically, it all boils down to, "Should a Christian support, in any way, that which God condemns?"
Since it is very clear that the Scripture declares the practice of homosexuality to be sin, I voted in favor of Prop. 8 and the California constitutional amendment defining marriage as being between a man and a woman. The fact that there is even a need to define marriage as being between a man and a woman is quite telling of our society's moral condition.
I divulge this information so that there is no question as to which side I am standing. I am writing from a fundamental Christian perspective, so my belief in the Bible as the word of God necessarily makes me biased.
It can be argued, with some success, that since the Bible condemns the practice of homosexuality we should not vote for same-sex marriage, but at the same time we should not vote against it, either. It has been said by some that we should not force our religious views on the lives of others. Interesting argument.
My objection is this:
I have heard it said, and in no way possess any legal training with which to evaluate such a claim, that just as we've heard of such legal victories as homosexuals claiming discrimination based on sexual orientation by wedding photographers who refused to shoot photos at a gay wedding, there would be similar legal ramifications against the church if same-sex marriages were legal and homosexuality was considered a "right" and as such placed on the same discrimination list as race, religion, sex, etc.
The scenario goes something like this: A gay couple wants to be married by an Adventist pastor, the pastor cannot oblige this request because his conscience won't allow it and because God condemns it, the gay couple sues the pastor/church for discrimination based on sexual orientation. Or, a homosexual applies to teach at an Adventist academy and is not hired and sues the school claiming discrimination based on sexual orientation. Or, an Adventist pastor marries someone of the same sex and is fired, at which time he sues the church claiming discrimination based on sexual orientation. Or, an Adventist preacher is sued for daring to stand in a pulpit and declare that the Bible calls the practice of homosexuality a sin. Or, an Adventist academy is sued for failing to include same-sex marriages in teachings about normal family units, or normal lifestyles.
I'm not sure if I laid those scenarios out correctly, but you get the point. If we place sexual orientation on the same level as race, religion, sex, etc., then we must, by law, accommodate those who practice homosexuality in every position within the church, and with every service provided by the church, or risk legal repercussions.
Even though, as Christians, our religious liberty affords us the ability to refrain from participating in or accommodating any activity we believe to be morally wrong, our laws are leaning more and more towards punishing those who do not condone, and accept, homosexuality as being morally right.
I've heard it said by some, speaking of the "homosexual agenda": first tolerance was demanded, then it wasn't enough to be tolerated, so acceptance was demanded, then it wasn't enough to be accepted, so they wanted their homosexual "rights" to be protected.
So it is with any sin. Years ago, before I was born, certain sins were done secretly, kept in the closet, because society as a whole condemned such reprehensible behavior. Slowly these sins began being practiced more openly, in spite of much condemnation. After a while, as the older generations began slipping into eternity and the younger generations emerged with these sins being a normal part of society, the sins once locked away behind closed doors and universally considered wrong, were now viewed as acceptable alternative lifestyles.
Consider this:
Top Disciplinary Problems in Schools:
1940: 1. Talking out of turn 2. Chewing gum 3. Making noise 4. Running in the halls 5. Cutting in line.
1990: 1. Drug abuse 2. Alcohol abuse 3. Pregnancy 4. Suicide 5. Rape.
Whether this list is actual or fictitious doesn't concern me, because what it demonstrates is absolutely true regardless.
We don't see the exceedingly sinful and rebellious state of our society because it's all we've ever known. The devil ever so slowly adds trace amounts of poison to our lives, not just individually, but generationally, until, without even realizing it, we have become a generation full of evil. It's the "boiling frog syndrome" in which the environment becomes lethal so slowly that those dying within it aren't even aware of the mortal danger by which they're surrounded.
Speaking of the days of Noah, just before the flood, the Bible says, "The LORD saw how great man's wickedness on the earth had become, and that every inclination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil all the time." - Genesis 6:5
Christ said of the generation living just prior to His second coming, "Just as it was in the days of Noah, so also will it be in the days of the Son of Man." - Luke 17:26
And again, "Because of the increase of wickedness, the love of most will grow cold, but he who stands firm to the end will be saved. And this gospel of the kingdom will be preached in the whole world as a testimony to all nations, and then the end will come." - Matthew 24:12-14
Lastly, a description that seems to be written specifically of our generation, "But know this, that in the last days perilous times will come: For men will be lovers of themselves, lovers of money, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy, unloving, unforgiving, slanderers, without self-control, brutal, despisers of good, traitors, headstrong, haughty, lovers of pleasure rather than lovers of God, having a form of godliness but denying its power. And from such people turn away!" - 2 Timothy 3:1-5
Again I say: to see a portion of God's own remnant church aligning themselves with the world on a wide "spectrum" of issues, and finding themselves opposed not only to the Scriptures, but to their Author, is something that sends chills down my spine.
But the knowledge that gives me peace is the following thought, as Clifford Goldstein replied when asked if he sees himself or others leaving the Adventist church for a more doctrinally homogeneous community if the worldly philosophies being espoused by some in the church continue:
"Well, if it were not for Ellen White and what she says about the future, I would think that would be a possibility. But my understanding is that is not what’s going to happen. My understanding, if I understand correctly, is that those who aren’t really grounded will be leaving. After all, if being an Adventist could cost you your life, you have to be a true believer, right?"
Since it is very clear that the Scripture declares the practice of homosexuality to be sin, I voted in favor of Prop. 8 and the California constitutional amendment defining marriage as being between a man and a woman. The fact that there is even a need to define marriage as being between a man and a woman is quite telling of our society's moral condition.
I divulge this information so that there is no question as to which side I am standing. I am writing from a fundamental Christian perspective, so my belief in the Bible as the word of God necessarily makes me biased.
It can be argued, with some success, that since the Bible condemns the practice of homosexuality we should not vote for same-sex marriage, but at the same time we should not vote against it, either. It has been said by some that we should not force our religious views on the lives of others. Interesting argument.
My objection is this:
I have heard it said, and in no way possess any legal training with which to evaluate such a claim, that just as we've heard of such legal victories as homosexuals claiming discrimination based on sexual orientation by wedding photographers who refused to shoot photos at a gay wedding, there would be similar legal ramifications against the church if same-sex marriages were legal and homosexuality was considered a "right" and as such placed on the same discrimination list as race, religion, sex, etc.
The scenario goes something like this: A gay couple wants to be married by an Adventist pastor, the pastor cannot oblige this request because his conscience won't allow it and because God condemns it, the gay couple sues the pastor/church for discrimination based on sexual orientation. Or, a homosexual applies to teach at an Adventist academy and is not hired and sues the school claiming discrimination based on sexual orientation. Or, an Adventist pastor marries someone of the same sex and is fired, at which time he sues the church claiming discrimination based on sexual orientation. Or, an Adventist preacher is sued for daring to stand in a pulpit and declare that the Bible calls the practice of homosexuality a sin. Or, an Adventist academy is sued for failing to include same-sex marriages in teachings about normal family units, or normal lifestyles.
I'm not sure if I laid those scenarios out correctly, but you get the point. If we place sexual orientation on the same level as race, religion, sex, etc., then we must, by law, accommodate those who practice homosexuality in every position within the church, and with every service provided by the church, or risk legal repercussions.
Even though, as Christians, our religious liberty affords us the ability to refrain from participating in or accommodating any activity we believe to be morally wrong, our laws are leaning more and more towards punishing those who do not condone, and accept, homosexuality as being morally right.
I've heard it said by some, speaking of the "homosexual agenda": first tolerance was demanded, then it wasn't enough to be tolerated, so acceptance was demanded, then it wasn't enough to be accepted, so they wanted their homosexual "rights" to be protected.
So it is with any sin. Years ago, before I was born, certain sins were done secretly, kept in the closet, because society as a whole condemned such reprehensible behavior. Slowly these sins began being practiced more openly, in spite of much condemnation. After a while, as the older generations began slipping into eternity and the younger generations emerged with these sins being a normal part of society, the sins once locked away behind closed doors and universally considered wrong, were now viewed as acceptable alternative lifestyles.
Consider this:
Top Disciplinary Problems in Schools:
1940: 1. Talking out of turn 2. Chewing gum 3. Making noise 4. Running in the halls 5. Cutting in line.
1990: 1. Drug abuse 2. Alcohol abuse 3. Pregnancy 4. Suicide 5. Rape.
Whether this list is actual or fictitious doesn't concern me, because what it demonstrates is absolutely true regardless.
We don't see the exceedingly sinful and rebellious state of our society because it's all we've ever known. The devil ever so slowly adds trace amounts of poison to our lives, not just individually, but generationally, until, without even realizing it, we have become a generation full of evil. It's the "boiling frog syndrome" in which the environment becomes lethal so slowly that those dying within it aren't even aware of the mortal danger by which they're surrounded.
Speaking of the days of Noah, just before the flood, the Bible says, "The LORD saw how great man's wickedness on the earth had become, and that every inclination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil all the time." - Genesis 6:5
Christ said of the generation living just prior to His second coming, "Just as it was in the days of Noah, so also will it be in the days of the Son of Man." - Luke 17:26
And again, "Because of the increase of wickedness, the love of most will grow cold, but he who stands firm to the end will be saved. And this gospel of the kingdom will be preached in the whole world as a testimony to all nations, and then the end will come." - Matthew 24:12-14
Lastly, a description that seems to be written specifically of our generation, "But know this, that in the last days perilous times will come: For men will be lovers of themselves, lovers of money, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy, unloving, unforgiving, slanderers, without self-control, brutal, despisers of good, traitors, headstrong, haughty, lovers of pleasure rather than lovers of God, having a form of godliness but denying its power. And from such people turn away!" - 2 Timothy 3:1-5
Again I say: to see a portion of God's own remnant church aligning themselves with the world on a wide "spectrum" of issues, and finding themselves opposed not only to the Scriptures, but to their Author, is something that sends chills down my spine.
But the knowledge that gives me peace is the following thought, as Clifford Goldstein replied when asked if he sees himself or others leaving the Adventist church for a more doctrinally homogeneous community if the worldly philosophies being espoused by some in the church continue:
"Well, if it were not for Ellen White and what she says about the future, I would think that would be a possibility. But my understanding is that is not what’s going to happen. My understanding, if I understand correctly, is that those who aren’t really grounded will be leaving. After all, if being an Adventist could cost you your life, you have to be a true believer, right?"
A Bundle of Choices
I've heard it explained so eloquently by Jim Hohnberger and received such a blessing from it, that I figured I'd try to write a post about it. You can find Jim's article about it by clicking here.
First, "the Christian life is not made up of doctrines, creeds, reforms, or church membership. It is not even made up of beliefs, but rather the Christian life is a bundle of choices. When God brings a truth or light to our understanding, it always comes with a choice. We must choose to submit to the will of God or refuse. When God has all my known choices, then He has me." - Jim Hohnberger.
The Christian life is a bundle of choices.
The Christian life is like a thick rope that has been cut in two. We are one piece and God is the other. Our goal is to be reconnected to Him. Each frayed strand of that rope is a possible choice. Every new truth we learn comes with a decision to make: will we follow? Will we surrender to God's will? If we choose to follow, then that strand becomes connected.
Caiaphas and the Thief on the Cross
Let's say for the sake of argument that there is a total of 100 choices that make up the Christian life. Out of those 100 choices, let's say that the thief on the cross only knew about 5 of them. But, on that cross, he surrendered to all 5 of his known choices. Jesus gave him assurance of salvation, why? Because he was 100% surrendered to God.
Let's say that Caiaphas, the high priest, knew about 70 of the choices, and was surrendered to 50 of them. If it was him on the cross instead of the thief, could Jesus have given him the same assurance that He gave the thief, that he would be with Him in paradise? No. Why not? Because he wasn't 100% surrendered to all his known choices.
Even though Caiaphas was surrendered to 10x more choices than the thief, he was not fully surrendered to all his known choices, whereas the thief was fully surrendered to all his known choices. And if the thief could have come down off that cross, God would have revealed more and more light to him and given him a chance to follow more and more and become more connected.
So, the Christian life is one of being surrendered to all of your known choices.
As we learn new truths, we have a choice as to whether we're going to submit to God and follow those truths, or whether we're going to say, "No, God." If we surrender ourselves to all our known choices, all the light God has revealed to us, then He will reveal more and more light (see Prov 4:18). If we do not surrender ourselves to God, what light we already have will be taken away (see 2 Thes 2:10,11; Mark 4:25; Matt 13:12).
The Rich Young Ruler
Then there's the story of the rich young ruler in Luke 18:18-23, who came to Christ and said, "What must I do to inherit eternal life?" At which point Jesus starts reciting the 10 commandments to him. So the rich young ruler says, "All these I have kept since my youth." And Jesus says, "One thing you lack, go and sell all your possessions and give to the poor, and you'll have treasure in heaven, and come follow me." Yet the rich young ruler walked away.
What did the rich young ruler's rope look like? He was fully connected except for one little string. All of the strands of his rope were connected to God except one last piece. Could Jesus have given him the same assurance of salvation that He gave the thief? No, because even though he had every strand of rope connected except the last string, he was not fully surrendered to all his known choices.
God doesn't want a 25% surrender from us, He doesn't want a 50% surrender from us, He doesn't even want a 99% surrender from us. He wants us to be fully, 100% surrendered to Him. With God, it's all or nothing. Remember what God said about being lukewarm in Revelation 3:16?
So the question we must ask ourselves is this: Are we fully surrendered to all of our known choices?
First, "the Christian life is not made up of doctrines, creeds, reforms, or church membership. It is not even made up of beliefs, but rather the Christian life is a bundle of choices. When God brings a truth or light to our understanding, it always comes with a choice. We must choose to submit to the will of God or refuse. When God has all my known choices, then He has me." - Jim Hohnberger.
The Christian life is a bundle of choices.
The Christian life is like a thick rope that has been cut in two. We are one piece and God is the other. Our goal is to be reconnected to Him. Each frayed strand of that rope is a possible choice. Every new truth we learn comes with a decision to make: will we follow? Will we surrender to God's will? If we choose to follow, then that strand becomes connected.
Caiaphas and the Thief on the Cross
Let's say for the sake of argument that there is a total of 100 choices that make up the Christian life. Out of those 100 choices, let's say that the thief on the cross only knew about 5 of them. But, on that cross, he surrendered to all 5 of his known choices. Jesus gave him assurance of salvation, why? Because he was 100% surrendered to God.
Let's say that Caiaphas, the high priest, knew about 70 of the choices, and was surrendered to 50 of them. If it was him on the cross instead of the thief, could Jesus have given him the same assurance that He gave the thief, that he would be with Him in paradise? No. Why not? Because he wasn't 100% surrendered to all his known choices.
Even though Caiaphas was surrendered to 10x more choices than the thief, he was not fully surrendered to all his known choices, whereas the thief was fully surrendered to all his known choices. And if the thief could have come down off that cross, God would have revealed more and more light to him and given him a chance to follow more and more and become more connected.
So, the Christian life is one of being surrendered to all of your known choices.
As we learn new truths, we have a choice as to whether we're going to submit to God and follow those truths, or whether we're going to say, "No, God." If we surrender ourselves to all our known choices, all the light God has revealed to us, then He will reveal more and more light (see Prov 4:18). If we do not surrender ourselves to God, what light we already have will be taken away (see 2 Thes 2:10,11; Mark 4:25; Matt 13:12).
The Rich Young Ruler
Then there's the story of the rich young ruler in Luke 18:18-23, who came to Christ and said, "What must I do to inherit eternal life?" At which point Jesus starts reciting the 10 commandments to him. So the rich young ruler says, "All these I have kept since my youth." And Jesus says, "One thing you lack, go and sell all your possessions and give to the poor, and you'll have treasure in heaven, and come follow me." Yet the rich young ruler walked away.
What did the rich young ruler's rope look like? He was fully connected except for one little string. All of the strands of his rope were connected to God except one last piece. Could Jesus have given him the same assurance of salvation that He gave the thief? No, because even though he had every strand of rope connected except the last string, he was not fully surrendered to all his known choices.
God doesn't want a 25% surrender from us, He doesn't want a 50% surrender from us, He doesn't even want a 99% surrender from us. He wants us to be fully, 100% surrendered to Him. With God, it's all or nothing. Remember what God said about being lukewarm in Revelation 3:16?
So the question we must ask ourselves is this: Are we fully surrendered to all of our known choices?
Friday, February 27, 2009
A Response To Adventist-Bashing
The following is a response I posted on a blog I found criticizing the Seventh-day Adventist church. As usual, there were a lot of erroneous statements as well as much undue focus on Ellen White. You may find it interesting to see what some misinformed people believe about the Seventh-day Adventist church. The original post can be found by clicking here.
Wow, this is one of the most inaccurate posts I've ever seen about Adventists. I hope you did this unknowingly and are not intentionally lying.
1. "The SDA church also publishes two of their own Bible "translations": The Study Bible and The Clear Word Bible." - NOT TRUE.
Any "Study Bibles" out there are regular translations such as NKJV, KJV, etc, which have study NOTES in them. They are not translations. "The Clear Word Bible" is a paraphrase from one man done as a personal devotional for himself, and is NOT endorsed by the Seventh-day Adventist church. Most SDA preachers use the NKJV, with some using NIV and KJV, etc.
2. "according to SDA's dogma, if an SDA does not accept Mrs. White as infallible, they have no salvation!" - NOT TRUE.
I have never met an Adventist who believes or teaches this, and it is certainly NOT the official position of the church. That is ridiculous. Whether one believes or disbelieves the counsel of Ellen White has nothing to do with salvation.
3. "SDAs believe that one can have immortality only on the condition that he comes to Christ through Ellen G. White; i.e., a works program, following salvation by grace with light of revelation through Ellen G. White as the infallible guide to Holy Scripture, apart from which one cannot have immortality.3 Then, at resurrection day, the body will be re-created (necessary because of soul sleep) for all those who believe in White's guidance and teachings (while non-SDAs will remain in "soul sleep" forever; i.e., will cease to exist [annihilated] and will not suffer everlasting torment). " - NOT TRUE.
SDAs teach that salvation is by grace alone, through faith alone, and not of works, lest anyone should boast. Christianity 101. Again, Adventists do not teach that salvation has anything to do with accepting Ellen White's counsel. Adventists do not believe that non-SDAs will remain in in the graves forever. First of all, Adventists teach that most of those who are part of what Jesus called the "resurrection of life" will not be Adventists at all. Secondly, those who did not accept Jesus Christ as Lord and Saviour (notice it has nothing to do with Ellen White) will not just stay in the grave forever. Adventists teach that "the rest of the dead lived not again until after the 1000 years" - Revelation, and that they will "have their part in the lake of fire (hell)", and will be in the "resurrection of damnation" according to Jesus Christ.
4. "Christ. Mrs. White: "Christ took upon His sinless nature our sinful nature"...According to SDA, then, Christ acquired a sinful nature! Of course, if this could have been so, there could have been no sinless sacrifice, no hope for sinners, and no Savior." - NOT TRUE.
The Bible says "God made Him who had no sin to be sin for us, so that in Him we might become the righteousness of God." - 2 Cor 5:21
So yes, Adventists believe what the Bible teaches: that Christ took our sins upon Himself to save us. He took what we deserve, and gave us what He deserves. Again, Christianity 101.
5. "Therefore, one must keep Old Testament dietary and ceremonial laws, paying particular attention to keep the Saturday Sabbath and the Ten Commandments, and most importantly, making sure to faithfully pay the tithe." - NOT TRUE.
Adventists do not teach that salvation comes by keeping ANY law, but by faith in Jesus Christ. Adventists teach that we should follow the dietary laws because God made our bodies and knows what is best for them, and studies have shown that Adventists live longer and have less diseases than the rest of the world. (check articles about the "Adventist Health Study" by ABC News, Good Morning America, National Geographic) Adventists teach the very opposite of what your post says about the ceremonial laws. Adventists teach that ceremonial laws pointed forward to Christ, were a shadow of things to come, and were nailed to the cross. Adventists also teach that paying tithe is between you and God, and they do not meddle in the finances of their members.
6. "SDAs are not "allowed" to experience assurance of salvation, because then there would be no pressure on them to keep the Old Testament law, as interpreted by Ellen G. White, and especially no pressure to pay the tithe" - NOT TRUE.
Adventists teach we can have assurance of salvation. They do NOT teach the false doctrine of "once saved always saved." Adventists teach what the Bible teaches, that we have free will and can choose to walk away from Christ and away from heaven.
"For if we sin willfully after we have received the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins"
"Now the just shall live by faith; But if anyone draws back, My soul has no pleasure in him. But we are not of those who draw back to perdition, but of those who believe to the saving of the soul." Heb 10:26, 38, 39.
7. "Many rank-and-file SDA members deny that their organization any longer decrees Ellen G. White a God-inspired prophet." - NOT TRUE.
Most Adventists do, and should, believe that Ellen White was inspired by God. It is indeed the official position of the church. Most Adventists do, however, understand that believing Ellen White is NOT salvational.
8. "Yet EGW made numerous false prophecies: that "Old Jerusalem never would be built up" (Early Writings, p. 75), that she would be alive at the Rapture (Early Writings, pp. 15-16), that Christ would return before slavery was abolished (Early Writings, pp. 35, 276), that Adventists living in 1856 would be alive at the Rapture (Testimonies for the Church, Vol. 3, pp. 131-132), and many more." - NOT TRUE.
The Bible is clear that God makes conditional prophecies. Jonah is not a false prophet, yet he prophesied: "And Jonah began to enter the city on the first day’s walk. Then he cried out and said, “Yet forty days, and Nineveh shall be overthrown!”, but they repented and, "God saw their works, that they turned from their evil way; and God relented from the disaster that He had said He would bring upon them, and He did not do it." - Job 2:4,10.
Many of Ellen White's prophecies concerning the return of Christ were also conditional upon God's people repenting and turning to Him, and fulfilling the great commission.
9. Ellen White quotes teaching salvation by works: ""Our acts, our words, even our most secret motives, all have their weight in deciding our destiny ... though ... forgotten by us, they [our works] will bear their testimony to justify or condemn"" - NOT TRUE,
If that statement is teaching salvation by works, then so is the Bible and Jesus.
Eccl 12:14, "God will bring every work into judgment, with every secret thing, whether it is good, or whether it is evil."
Rom 2:15 "who show the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and between themselves their thoughts accusing or else excusing them"
Matt 12:36 Christ speaking, "But I say to you that for every idle word men may speak, they will give account of it in the day of judgment."
10. Ellen White quote teaching salvation by works: ""When any have sins remaining upon the books of record, unrepented of and unforgiven, their names will be blotted out of the book of life ..." - NOT TRUE.
1 Jn 1:9, "If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness."
We must repent of our sins to be forgiven and cleansed. If we don't, and they are not forgiven and cleansed, then we know the "wages of sin is death." This is not teaching salvation by works, but is again Christianity 101.
11. Ellen White quote teaching salvation by works, ""Each one of you needs to ... [be] working with your might to redeem the failures of your past life. God has placed you in a world of suffering to prove you, to see if you will be found worthy of the gift of eternal life"" - NOT TRUE.
Certainly Christians believe in the concept of restoration. If we become Christians, shouldn't we pay back anything we've stolen, or try to make right any wrongs we've done to people in our past lives?
Works do not save anyone, but they do prove that their conversion is genuine. As James says, "Show me your faith without your works, and I will show you my faith by my works.", "You see then that a man is justified by works, and not by faith only.", "For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also." - Ja 2:18,24,26. Was James teaching salvation by works?
And as the reformer William Tyndale said: "The fruit that grows on a tree does not make the tree good or bad. It only makes known whether the tree is a good tree or a bad tree. Works do not make a man good or bad. They only make it plain to other men that he who performs those works is good or bad. The man is reconciled before God by faith alone and works are only to make this justification known before men." Was Tyndale teaching salvation by works?
And as Christ said, "By their fruit you shall know them." and "He who abides in Me bears much fruit." Was Christ teaching salvation by works?
Please, I beg you to consider carefully when presenting your views about the Adventist church...take the time to actually learn what Adventists really teach and believe instead of taking the words of other people.
Let's make sure the Bible is used as our sole source of truth.
Wow, this is one of the most inaccurate posts I've ever seen about Adventists. I hope you did this unknowingly and are not intentionally lying.
1. "The SDA church also publishes two of their own Bible "translations": The Study Bible and The Clear Word Bible." - NOT TRUE.
Any "Study Bibles" out there are regular translations such as NKJV, KJV, etc, which have study NOTES in them. They are not translations. "The Clear Word Bible" is a paraphrase from one man done as a personal devotional for himself, and is NOT endorsed by the Seventh-day Adventist church. Most SDA preachers use the NKJV, with some using NIV and KJV, etc.
2. "according to SDA's dogma, if an SDA does not accept Mrs. White as infallible, they have no salvation!" - NOT TRUE.
I have never met an Adventist who believes or teaches this, and it is certainly NOT the official position of the church. That is ridiculous. Whether one believes or disbelieves the counsel of Ellen White has nothing to do with salvation.
3. "SDAs believe that one can have immortality only on the condition that he comes to Christ through Ellen G. White; i.e., a works program, following salvation by grace with light of revelation through Ellen G. White as the infallible guide to Holy Scripture, apart from which one cannot have immortality.3 Then, at resurrection day, the body will be re-created (necessary because of soul sleep) for all those who believe in White's guidance and teachings (while non-SDAs will remain in "soul sleep" forever; i.e., will cease to exist [annihilated] and will not suffer everlasting torment). " - NOT TRUE.
SDAs teach that salvation is by grace alone, through faith alone, and not of works, lest anyone should boast. Christianity 101. Again, Adventists do not teach that salvation has anything to do with accepting Ellen White's counsel. Adventists do not believe that non-SDAs will remain in in the graves forever. First of all, Adventists teach that most of those who are part of what Jesus called the "resurrection of life" will not be Adventists at all. Secondly, those who did not accept Jesus Christ as Lord and Saviour (notice it has nothing to do with Ellen White) will not just stay in the grave forever. Adventists teach that "the rest of the dead lived not again until after the 1000 years" - Revelation, and that they will "have their part in the lake of fire (hell)", and will be in the "resurrection of damnation" according to Jesus Christ.
4. "Christ. Mrs. White: "Christ took upon His sinless nature our sinful nature"...According to SDA, then, Christ acquired a sinful nature! Of course, if this could have been so, there could have been no sinless sacrifice, no hope for sinners, and no Savior." - NOT TRUE.
The Bible says "God made Him who had no sin to be sin for us, so that in Him we might become the righteousness of God." - 2 Cor 5:21
So yes, Adventists believe what the Bible teaches: that Christ took our sins upon Himself to save us. He took what we deserve, and gave us what He deserves. Again, Christianity 101.
5. "Therefore, one must keep Old Testament dietary and ceremonial laws, paying particular attention to keep the Saturday Sabbath and the Ten Commandments, and most importantly, making sure to faithfully pay the tithe." - NOT TRUE.
Adventists do not teach that salvation comes by keeping ANY law, but by faith in Jesus Christ. Adventists teach that we should follow the dietary laws because God made our bodies and knows what is best for them, and studies have shown that Adventists live longer and have less diseases than the rest of the world. (check articles about the "Adventist Health Study" by ABC News, Good Morning America, National Geographic) Adventists teach the very opposite of what your post says about the ceremonial laws. Adventists teach that ceremonial laws pointed forward to Christ, were a shadow of things to come, and were nailed to the cross. Adventists also teach that paying tithe is between you and God, and they do not meddle in the finances of their members.
6. "SDAs are not "allowed" to experience assurance of salvation, because then there would be no pressure on them to keep the Old Testament law, as interpreted by Ellen G. White, and especially no pressure to pay the tithe" - NOT TRUE.
Adventists teach we can have assurance of salvation. They do NOT teach the false doctrine of "once saved always saved." Adventists teach what the Bible teaches, that we have free will and can choose to walk away from Christ and away from heaven.
"For if we sin willfully after we have received the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins"
"Now the just shall live by faith; But if anyone draws back, My soul has no pleasure in him. But we are not of those who draw back to perdition, but of those who believe to the saving of the soul." Heb 10:26, 38, 39.
7. "Many rank-and-file SDA members deny that their organization any longer decrees Ellen G. White a God-inspired prophet." - NOT TRUE.
Most Adventists do, and should, believe that Ellen White was inspired by God. It is indeed the official position of the church. Most Adventists do, however, understand that believing Ellen White is NOT salvational.
8. "Yet EGW made numerous false prophecies: that "Old Jerusalem never would be built up" (Early Writings, p. 75), that she would be alive at the Rapture (Early Writings, pp. 15-16), that Christ would return before slavery was abolished (Early Writings, pp. 35, 276), that Adventists living in 1856 would be alive at the Rapture (Testimonies for the Church, Vol. 3, pp. 131-132), and many more." - NOT TRUE.
The Bible is clear that God makes conditional prophecies. Jonah is not a false prophet, yet he prophesied: "And Jonah began to enter the city on the first day’s walk. Then he cried out and said, “Yet forty days, and Nineveh shall be overthrown!”, but they repented and, "God saw their works, that they turned from their evil way; and God relented from the disaster that He had said He would bring upon them, and He did not do it." - Job 2:4,10.
Many of Ellen White's prophecies concerning the return of Christ were also conditional upon God's people repenting and turning to Him, and fulfilling the great commission.
9. Ellen White quotes teaching salvation by works: ""Our acts, our words, even our most secret motives, all have their weight in deciding our destiny ... though ... forgotten by us, they [our works] will bear their testimony to justify or condemn"" - NOT TRUE,
If that statement is teaching salvation by works, then so is the Bible and Jesus.
Eccl 12:14, "God will bring every work into judgment, with every secret thing, whether it is good, or whether it is evil."
Rom 2:15 "who show the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and between themselves their thoughts accusing or else excusing them"
Matt 12:36 Christ speaking, "But I say to you that for every idle word men may speak, they will give account of it in the day of judgment."
10. Ellen White quote teaching salvation by works: ""When any have sins remaining upon the books of record, unrepented of and unforgiven, their names will be blotted out of the book of life ..." - NOT TRUE.
1 Jn 1:9, "If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness."
We must repent of our sins to be forgiven and cleansed. If we don't, and they are not forgiven and cleansed, then we know the "wages of sin is death." This is not teaching salvation by works, but is again Christianity 101.
11. Ellen White quote teaching salvation by works, ""Each one of you needs to ... [be] working with your might to redeem the failures of your past life. God has placed you in a world of suffering to prove you, to see if you will be found worthy of the gift of eternal life"" - NOT TRUE.
Certainly Christians believe in the concept of restoration. If we become Christians, shouldn't we pay back anything we've stolen, or try to make right any wrongs we've done to people in our past lives?
Works do not save anyone, but they do prove that their conversion is genuine. As James says, "Show me your faith without your works, and I will show you my faith by my works.", "You see then that a man is justified by works, and not by faith only.", "For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also." - Ja 2:18,24,26. Was James teaching salvation by works?
And as the reformer William Tyndale said: "The fruit that grows on a tree does not make the tree good or bad. It only makes known whether the tree is a good tree or a bad tree. Works do not make a man good or bad. They only make it plain to other men that he who performs those works is good or bad. The man is reconciled before God by faith alone and works are only to make this justification known before men." Was Tyndale teaching salvation by works?
And as Christ said, "By their fruit you shall know them." and "He who abides in Me bears much fruit." Was Christ teaching salvation by works?
Please, I beg you to consider carefully when presenting your views about the Adventist church...take the time to actually learn what Adventists really teach and believe instead of taking the words of other people.
Let's make sure the Bible is used as our sole source of truth.
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